# Who is responsible for the original sin? **URL:** \ **Category:** Philosophy of Religion\ **Created:** [May 14, 2026, 9:39pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003 "2026-05-14T21:39:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 8:31pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/81 "2026-05-16T20:31:20Z")
> [@Jackal](#): > > We assume God is just. Yes, we assume so many false things. Have your cake and eat it too. > [@Jackal](#): > > Let’s not make it religious. Say your dad tells you not to stick a fork in an electrical outlet and your little brother (bear in mind, Adam and Eve were given _dominion_ over the animals evidenced by the fact they were allowed to name them so it’s not like a big brother or random adult authority figure) tells you to, and you do it. Who do you think is it at fault. It is certainly not me. So we are left with my brother and father. Unfortunately, we cannot deduce more since no more information is provided. Anyhow, there is no relation between this example and the story, so I don’t understand what your point is. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 8:33pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/82 "2026-05-16T20:33:22Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > I think there was. But you failed to see it. So please tell me what the relation is. > [@Corvus](#): > > Why do you claim it is reasonable? I provide my analysis, and I am wondering if it is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 8:45pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/83 "2026-05-16T20:45:42Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > So please tell me what the relation is. My idea was that if God is not person, then God cannot be responsible for original sin. > [@MoK](#): > > I provide my analysis, and I am wondering if it is wrong. Yes, the whole point is going over each analysis on the raised points. If God is not responsible for original sin, then maybe the allegorical tale was for giving us the divine message from the story? That is just my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 8:51pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/84 "2026-05-16T20:51:47Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > My idea was that if God is not person, then God cannot be responsible for original sin. Why not? We have four characters here, so one of them must be responsible for the first sin. Don’t you agree? ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 8:58pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/85 "2026-05-16T20:58:32Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > Why not? We have four characters here, so one of them must be responsible for the first sin. Don’t you agree? As I kept suggesting, normativity is that you don’t blame or impose responsibility to nonhuman entities like God or devil for sins of humans. Only humans are responsible for their sins or wrong doings. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 9:00pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/86 "2026-05-16T21:00:36Z")
But humans in the story could not be held responsible for the first sin since they were fooled by the Serpent. ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 9:08pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/87 "2026-05-16T21:08:42Z")
This is the point. That is why I was saying the story is to pass on the messages from God, rather than about sin. The possible divine messages are, 1. Ignorance is also sin. Read and learn make yourself knowledgeable to survive in the real world. 2. God doesn’t love humans. 3. God will hide himself away from humans. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 9:53pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/88 "2026-05-16T21:53:58Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > Ignorance is also sin. Ignorance is not a sin; it is bad. > [@Corvus](#): > > God doesn’t love humans. Probably! But I am interested in understanding who is responsible for the first sin. ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:07pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/89 "2026-05-16T22:07:10Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > Ignorance is not a sin; it is bad. That is your personal opinion. > [@MoK](#): > > Probably! But I am interested in understanding who is responsible for the first sin. I accept you are. But I feel it seems not possible to conclude who is responsible for the first sin due to the circumstances (lack of exact material evidence) and also the nature of the characters involved in the story i.e. God, devil and humans. I am not sure, if God in OT spoke directly to humans. I was under impression, it was always either the prophets or author of OT spoke on behalf of God. If that is the case, then we cannot be certain, if God’s words were the actual words he spoke or not. There might have been misinterpretations in their communications too. ---
**Author:** ![Fooloso4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aeb1de/32.png) [@Fooloso4](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Fooloso4)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:41pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/90 "2026-05-16T22:41:14Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > No tree of knowledge, and they would be free to do whatever they want to do, Only in so far as what they want to do does not require knowledge. Chapter 4 opens with Adam knowing Eve and producing offspring. Eve desired the fruit of the tree of knowledge because she desired wisdom. (3.6) Aristotle’s Metaphysics begins by saying that all men by nature desire to know. Is God responsible for her following her desires? God does not give man this desire, he warns them off but does not prevent Adam and Eve from gaining knowledge. He does not treat them like pets lacking independence and choices. What is the connection between her desire to be wise by eating of the tree of knowledge and her desire for her husband (3.16)? In both cases the consequences are both good and bad. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:49pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/91 "2026-05-16T22:49:52Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > But I feel it seems not possible to conclude who is responsible for the first sin due to the circumstances (lack of exact material evidence) and also the nature of the characters involved in the story i.e. God, devil and humans. But God punished the Serpent and humans. God was right or wrong! Take your pick. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:51pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/92 "2026-05-16T22:51:50Z")
So, you agree that God created man with the desire to know and then punish him because he tried to know!? ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:55pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/93 "2026-05-16T22:55:42Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > But God punished the Serpent and humans. God was right or wrong! Take your pick. God is above right or wrong. Humans don’t have right to judge God. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 10:57pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/94 "2026-05-16T22:57:04Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > God is above right or wrong. Just take your pick! ---
**Author:** ![Banno](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/banno/32/55_2.png) [@Banno](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Banno)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:07pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/95 "2026-05-16T23:07:34Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > Humans don’t have right to judge God. …and yet they must. ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:33pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/96 "2026-05-16T23:33:15Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > Just take your pick! Another problem here is that definition of sin. Sin is defined as “offence against God” in the Bible. If God is responsible for original sin, how can God be responsible for offence against God himself? Can you offend yourself, and be responsible for the offence you caused to yourself? ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:35pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/97 "2026-05-16T23:35:55Z")
> [@Banno](#): > > …and yet they must. They will say, by definition of God, God is above judgement. ---
**Author:** ![MoK](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/mok/32/578_2.png) [@MoK](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/MoK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:37pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/98 "2026-05-16T23:37:57Z")
I will answer that after you take your pick! ---
**Author:** ![Banno](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/banno/32/55_2.png) [@Banno](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Banno)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:39pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/99 "2026-05-16T23:39:19Z")
> [@Corvus](#): > > They will say, by definition of God, God is above judgement. …and in so doing they judge god. ---
**Author:** ![Corvus](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex007/user_avatar/www.thephilosophyforum.com/corvus/32/1606_2.png) [@Corvus](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/u/Corvus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2026, 11:41pm UTC](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003/100 "2026-05-16T23:41:06Z")
> [@MoK](#): > > I will answer that after you take your pick! I am open minded on all the issues until the conclusion emerges after the full discussion. I don’t have enough data to take pick at the stage. We need more findings on the issue by asking questions and inspecting the answers before coming to any conclusion. [Previous page](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003.md?page=4) [Next page](https://www.thephilosophyforum.com/t/who-is-responsible-for-the-original-sin/1003.md?page=6)